Let's embark on a journey of Colin Taylor, a professional groomer from humble beginnings working in a pet shop, to becoming a worldwide renowned figure in pet grooming, Colin's story is one of passion, persistence, and love for furry friends. He shares his transformative experiences, including his move to the countryside to establish a unique product line and educational programs, as well as overcoming a childhood stammer that ultimately shaped his character and career.
We then step into the world of competitive pet grooming, an arena where Colin has carved out a significant presence. It's a world filled with feedback from judges, the building of strong bonds between groomer and pet, and the vital importance of a sense of belonging. His unique perspective on these industry nuances lends valuable insights, particularly for those with aspirations to groom pets professionally.
The episode culminates in Colin’s offering a wealth of advice for those interested in the pet grooming industry. He shares his expert tips on starting and finishing a grooming routine, the importance of timing, and how to achieve the desired shape and volume of a pet in a competition. Additionally, we delve into Colin's experience with the Pooch Perfect TV show and his vision for the future. It's an episode loaded with inspiring stories and practical advice that will leave you motivated and informed. Be it a professional groomer, a pet lover, or someone fascinated by industry tales, this is an episode you won't want to miss. Tune in and get inspired!
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Dog Supplements | PawMega | We Make Dog Food Better – PawMega - Make Dog Food Better
Dog Grooming Solutions – Botaniqa Global, Inc. (botaniqa-usa.com) Discount Code: HandlingIt
Let's embark on a journey of Colin Taylor, a professional groomer from humble beginnings working in a pet shop, to becoming a worldwide renowned figure in pet grooming, Colin's story is one of passion, persistence, and love for furry friends. He shares his transformative experiences, including his move to the countryside to establish a unique product line and educational programs, as well as overcoming a childhood stammer that ultimately shaped his character and career.
We then step into the world of competitive pet grooming, an arena where Colin has carved out a significant presence. It's a world filled with feedback from judges, the building of strong bonds between groomer and pet, and the vital importance of a sense of belonging. His unique perspective on these industry nuances lends valuable insights, particularly for those with aspirations to groom pets professionally.
The episode culminates in Colin’s offering a wealth of advice for those interested in the pet grooming industry. He shares his expert tips on starting and finishing a grooming routine, the importance of timing, and how to achieve the desired shape and volume of a pet in a competition. Additionally, we delve into Colin's experience with the Pooch Perfect TV show and his vision for the future. It's an episode loaded with inspiring stories and practical advice that will leave you motivated and informed. Be it a professional groomer, a pet lover, or someone fascinated by industry tales, this is an episode you won't want to miss. Tune in and get inspired!
Collections – Botaniqa Global, Inc. (botaniqa-usa.com)
Discount Code: HandlingIt
Dog Supplements | PawMega | We Make Dog Food Better – PawMega - Make Dog Food Better
Dog Grooming Solutions – Botaniqa Global, Inc. (botaniqa-usa.com) Discount Code: HandlingIt
Hey everyone, welcome back to Handling it. Today's guest we have on is Colin Taylor. Hi, we're so excited to have you.
Speaker 3:Oh, thank you so much. Thank you for having me.
Speaker 2:Of course it's, yeah.
Speaker 1:I've been a huge fan. I followed you since pretty much, since I've known about the whole industry, since I've gotten out of the groomer closet and just found out about this whole world of education and competition and whatnot. So you've been one of my first people I've known about.
Speaker 3:Oh well thank you.
Speaker 1:A little secret. You messaged me about a year ago when I had the Iowa Lakes competition and you're like I would love to come to the next one and I like fangirled. I'm like, how did he even have me in his contact? How did he know me, messaged me, so like. Since then I just felt like I was seen.
Speaker 3:You know what I would like? I've always wanted to go, what I was supposed to go to Iowa last year, and then obviously my lovely husband decided to go and get cancer on us so we couldn't do it, so we had to stay in England and he's fine. Now he's totally everything's perfect. So we, yeah, but we're supposed to be there last year, but that's okay, we will be there.
Speaker 1:Well, when you are here, yeah, in Iowa.
Speaker 3:I would love to. I'll be at Hershey, right. Yeah, I'll be at Hershey, yeah, absolutely, I can finally meet you there, yeah.
Speaker 1:You have a booth too, right? Yes, I do, I got a booth GL22, right near the escalators.
Speaker 3:My first year with a booth at Hershey, which I'm really excited about and that's amazing, yeah. So it's going to be lots and lots of fun. I have an all day seminar on Thursday and then I got my booth and then I'm judging open poodle and, I think, workshop, intermediate and maybe sporting, I think, without looking at it.
Speaker 2:Awesome, oh my God.
Speaker 1:Tell us more about your booth, because I've been watching you. I've been watching your new product lines come out. Can you explain all that good stuff?
Speaker 3:Yeah, sure. So I mean, obviously I've been grooming, for I have. I don't groom anymore. I've been grooming in the industry for 37 years now and it was when I moved back to the UK and I was working in London and I was teaching actually, and I just wanted to change in life. I wanted to do something totally different. So me and my husband moved to the countryside, like 20 minutes outside of from Stonehenge, and I said I'm going to work from home and sell products and do education. And it was a big move because obviously you don't have a steady income coming in, you have to really work with it. And I just wanted to come out with products that I loved.
Speaker 3:And you know I'm a person who I'm probably better off working for myself because you know, if I work for another company or I'm an ambassador, I have to always watch what I say and not say. But I don't like to watch what I say. I just don't like to be muzzled. If I have a strong an opinion on something, I don't want to be able to say it and, being my own boss, I can say whatever I want to say and hopefully, whether it upsets people or not, I don't go on my way to do that, but some things I just have to say out loud and that's what I do. So it's a lot of fun Brushes I'm a big fan of really good brushes and combs and now I'm delving into the shear line and I'm Pina's going to be on my booth because we have a signature scissor from her, which is really, really cool. And I'm a huge Pina's, like my sister. She stays in my house a lot and we roll around on the couch and laugh at each other. That's what we do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I saw her live the other day. It looked like she had some really good scissors, so that's very, very exciting.
Speaker 3:Absolutely.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you said you were grooming for more than 30 years before you started. Can you tell us how you got into grooming?
Speaker 3:Yes, I was. Well, first of all, let's go back to school. I wasn't very good in school. My dream was to be a primatologist and study gorillas. They're still my favorite animal, next being the killer whale. So I wanted to. So that's what my dream was, but you needed a biology degree. I didn't have a degree in biology, so I worked in a pet shop and was the livestock manager, cleaning guinea pigs out and all that kind of stuff and loving every minute of it. And a girl came in and bought nail clippers and said she's a dog groomer. And I'm like well, you know what? I'll try it. Never, ever in my million years, I ever think about becoming a dog groomer.
Speaker 1:Yeah, most people don't.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I went from there and it I found it easy to a point. I hated doing poodle feet when I was a student, so they gave me more poodles, obviously. Yes, it kind of went from there and then my career blossomed. I went to Hong Kong for two years and worked in Hong Kong and then when I came home to England from Hong Kong, I'm like I don't want to live here no more. And that's where my dreams of traveling came into play.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:How does one just? Is that normal? Because I feel here in Iowa we don't be like I'm just going to move to Hong Kong for you know two years and go learn from someone or go you know groom Like how does? Is that just something culturally like you?
Speaker 3:you know, it's okay.
Speaker 3:I was. First of all, I was a very shy child with a really bad stammer. I had a really horrible stutter. I hated reading out loud in school. I didn't want to be in no spotlight. I just I know, and something in me was like you know what, you have to try and do something for yourself and, you know, become more. I wasn't unsocial. I love people. But I was very, very, just, very, I know, really, really kind of not. It wasn't even a bad thing. I was never bullied. It was just like you know. I was just felt like I had to be really good at something.
Speaker 3:And I've picked dog groom and I'm like if you're going to groom dogs for the rest of your life, you better be really good at it. And I think there was a lot of self searching for myself also as a child. Obviously I'm a gay man and I think when you're a young gay man you're kind of trying to figure out where you fit in or what you're going to do or where you're going to go. And you know, sometimes you kind of I don't know whether I did it or not, but maybe it's because I thought I got to find myself on my own and not do it around my family, so I could be do it secretly, I don't know.
Speaker 3:But maybe that's what it was like.
Speaker 2:I know, it's kind of like being a teenager like a second time. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:You know, you kind of want to like. You know. I mean, I don't know, I smoked behind the parents backs. I used to French girls down in the park and all that kind of stuff. And now I'm like, what do I do now? Yeah, so that's where it went.
Speaker 3:So you did that in Hong Kong oh yeah, I moved to Hong Kong and that was a really strange, incredible experience, because they treat dogs incredibly well there. The country is very, very hot and it was owned by the British back then and the only place that was clean was where they, the queen, used to pull up in the QE2. And it was it was. It taught me more than school ever could teach me about respect and understanding. But not everybody has chances in life and people do become homeless because they made some bad choices, not because they're bad people. So it kind of taught me a lot about about life in general, which really did help me out, I think, in bringing myself out of my shell a little bit more.
Speaker 1:Yeah, becoming who you are today, that's cool.
Speaker 2:I didn't know that, yeah.
Speaker 1:So with all of that, how did one become Colin Taylor, to be known literally worldwide?
Speaker 2:Um drama. No I don't, it's a loaded question.
Speaker 3:You know I think it was. You know what I am and I and I this is not to sound corny at all I followed Madonna since I was, since 1983. I respect that woman so much because I don't give a crap way Anybody says about her. She's still around today doing what she does. So I love longevity and I've always said to myself you know what you have to do, whatever you can be, to be the best, and that means you have to travel around, visit people like Pina, like Sally Hawks Back in that day it was Terry D'Marino, liz Paul and you got to learn from the best people in the world.
Speaker 3:And also, we didn't have social media, we didn't have Facebook, we didn't have Instagram or TikTok. So when you did things, you had to do things on your own accord. There was no handouts. There was no. You can jump from A to Z. You had to go through ABC DNA to become the best, and you know. So that's what I did.
Speaker 3:I, um, I went to the, the, the first ever Worlds competition in 1987 in Windsor, and um, I met Terry. I met, um John Vivian Nash, I met a bunch of people and, um, they said to me your scissor work is flawless. Your angulation, however, and your balance is terrible, but with some tweaks you could become really good. You need to move to America. So I had two offers. One was in Manhattan Beach, california, one was in Lansing, michigan, and for some reason I picked Lansing Michigan, working for Dina Perry, who was incredible and still is incredible, and um, I owe so much to that woman because she is a force of, a force of nature in her own, in her own right. She's incredible and um. So next thing, I know I'm on a plane going to Lansing in Detroit and I've come out the clouds. I'm like what the hell is all this snow here? I didn't know America had snow, because when you're a young person, when you think about America, you think about two places Florida and California. You don't think about America having snow.
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh, okay, that's funny, and so when you went to now, I just kind of want to know your story. So keep going from Michigan.
Speaker 3:So I landed in Michigan. Dina, um put me, took me to the school in Lansing and I lived above the school and I loved it. And I got the first ever time I got acquainted to homes shopping network and I was taking photos of the television television and saying to my mom and dad, people buy crap on the TV in this country. And, um, I said it's really really bad stuff too. But but I, I, everything was. Everything was like, everything was new, it hadn't sunk into me, but I would be living here and when. When you live somewhere, it's all relative. You've got bills, you've got, you've got a paper and stuff.
Speaker 3:So, um, I worked at the Michigan school of K9 Cosmetology. I went to my first competition in 1989 in Chicago, the All American, and I got third place with, um, my English, with eight English Spanish. Then I came back and then I drove to Iowa, Des Moines and I and it was hilarious, I did a last episode. That last episode, scissor did all over, put little Halloween bows in its ears. I got Jerry Schimberg was my judge, got first place for that dog and I did this little, um, silver poodle. I put little bows and hurriers too and I got first place for that dog.
Speaker 3:Um, but my scissoring was always and I have to get myself give my sort of pat on my back, but scissoring was amazing and it still is amazing for a 54 year old. I'm still, I still, I still got it when I want to, when I want to have it, I can turn it out on the perfectly beautifully prepared given dog, Um, so, yeah, so it just went from there and I went from, I find, come being a competitor which I'm really surprised about with myself, the old Colin Taylor who was shy. Now I'm like I want to compete, I want to compete more, I love competing, yeah, Um, and I love competing and I love placing. I do not like honorable mentions. I tell my judges if you like my work, but not enough to place me, do not give me an honorable mention. I don't want no pity trophy. Don't do it, and so yeah, that's how.
Speaker 1:I feel the tone it feels to.
Speaker 3:Yeah, that's what you give the. You know, that's like. You know, when you have, it's like me as a kid, the little fat kid, I'll give him a participation, rosette, so he feels good. No, don't do that you know what I mean. Exactly If I do good, then I deserve it, if I don't, I don't get nothing.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's funny.
Speaker 1:So you went to Hong Kong, you moved to Michigan, did I hear? That right, you went back to dog grooming school here in the States.
Speaker 3:I didn't know that. I went back to teaching. I was teaching.
Speaker 1:Okay, I was like holy crap.
Speaker 3:So I that's what I said I want to be a teacher. So I became a teacher for Michigan, for Dean of Perry, and also I worked to mobile vans, which I didn't like.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I feel like that's like a hit or a miss for people. Either people love it or they hate it.
Speaker 3:I'm up to. I like to be around people having to laugh and to giggle, and you know, I like to communicate Me stuck in a van. It's like it's so isolating and you know, I got a real bad imagination. I thought I'd do this to be some crazy man, come back and kill me or something like that. You know what.
Speaker 1:I mean I'm with you. Intrusive thoughts right here. Like I wear that crown.
Speaker 3:Exactly, I don't want to weirdo coming out to the van and you know I'm going to be like Lord, I'm dead, and all that kind of stuff. And Barry, I mean, he's back garden. No, no, that's just not me.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's where my brain goes to. So that's cool, so like just surrounding yourself with people and like always learning from somebody, and that's kind of how you've made your trail.
Speaker 3:Absolutely, and you know and I've always, you know I've always promoted people. But of course education is key. You know you never get anywhere in life. You know if you don't, aren't willing to put yourself out there and learn and be told what you've done wrong. I'm a big old constructive criticism and all that kind of stuff and it's important to me that when I'm judging I always give it honest but nice opinion to somebody.
Speaker 3:I don't want to deter somebody from competing. I want to encourage them and I think I think feedback is so important, because that's what you guys are paying for. You guys are paying to compete and find out what you did wrong, and that's one thing. That's lacking around the world is proper feedback.
Speaker 1:Yeah. We want to know what we did wrong, but we also want to know that we have a spot here too, and when we have that judge, make sure and validate, like, hey, you didn't place, but you have it almost. And they tell us all the things or you're doing it, but this was beautiful and hey, you belong here just as much as everybody else does.
Speaker 3:Exactly, exactly. You know you want them to feel, you know. I mean, you know, to me everybody should get a courtesy come when I'm judging and you know what I know. But when I look at them people up there grouping them, dogs, there's a million people which were which, which I was that person years ago.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:So I understand what it's like to be that person. I understand in this industry we are very much a. They don't think much of themselves, they have exact anxiety, they suffer with panic and I thought so I kind of relate to people in understanding you've got to nurture them and they're like. They're like they're my children to a point. I want to make sure they feel good about themselves and even if it's not a job, even if it's, like you know, not the perfect job, you know it's probably their best work to date and that's what counts, that's what matters, yeah, and they could always grow.
Speaker 2:It's so interesting hearing that from a judge's perspective because that's something like as a competitor like, you just get nervous in your head and you're like you don't know what anyone is thinking. So it's really cool to hear like how, as a judge, you like see those things, because sometimes you just feel alone on the stage, you know, and it just gets so overwhelming, so fast Like but but just remember that that alone time you have on your dog is the most beautiful bond and experience in the world.
Speaker 3:And I've always said to people like I always bring up the movie Avatar, you know an avatar where they connect to the animals. You know that is your chance to connect with that dog. And I tell people time and time again you may be the best groom in the world, but that dog has allowed you to become the best groom in the world. So in my opinion we need to give more credit to the dogs and I would love to see shows give more prizes to the dogs too.
Speaker 1:Oh, that is so cool.
Speaker 3:Yeah, well, I mean, I think it's true, I think I think at my show I'm going to implement, you know, where the dog gets a bed and some treats and some whatever it may be because that dog has worked as hard as you have and people seem to forget that Absolutely and nine times out of 10,. If you don't place is because you haven't, it's because it hasn't been your day, not, it has nothing to the dog yeah, the dog stands there perfectly all the time.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's such a sweet idea.
Speaker 2:We ask so much of them. So it really is like, yeah, we definitely do need to be taking the dogs into consideration more, and I love that idea of like rewarding the dogs too. That's amazing.
Speaker 1:I try so hard with Sterling after he's done. He's my dandy dinma. I'll go out back. I don't care if it looks stupid, but we just sprint and he's just the happiest guy in his truck. He's like you know and that's all he wants is a good old sprint run and I'm like, but you know that's all he wanted to do and he felt good and he was like winning and doing everything, but that's that's Sterling's and I is little like a precious little. We did it. I'm dying, he's loving it.
Speaker 3:But exactly, exactly, you know. So yeah, but I think it's just one thing, it's different things we can look at. I mean, you know we all get rewarded, we all think you know, I mean you know, I mean I say to some people you know what, you might be incredible, but look what has given you that opportunity to be that incredible. It's beautiful dogs, you know, and we all side off with maybe some manky manky dogs and all that kind of stuff.
Speaker 3:And you know. But then dogs still, they were on your journey with you. They put you on the map today, no matter what they were. So you know, that's that side of me which is, you know, that kind of person I'm. Just, you know, I like to see a little bit more done for the actual animals to be fair.
Speaker 1:Well now I wonder if we'll see it. You just put it out in the universe.
Speaker 3:I hope so, I do hope so. There you go Um.
Speaker 1:next question, though, is you just talked about kind of being a lifelong learner earlier. If you had to choose one person right now, if you could ask them to teach you something or get a lesson from, who would you choose?
Speaker 3:Pina.
Speaker 1:Pina.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I hope I can help you with that.
Speaker 3:You know what? The one thing I love about Pina and I've hired her many times to speak at my seminars in the UK Pina was tell you to do something and then she would tell you why. You know it's one thing to say have here somebody say, okay, go down the angle on that back leg tighter, but do they ever tell you why? Not always Pina tells you the reasons behind the. You know the wise, and that's really really important. Plus, pina is Just an incredible world of knowledge and that's the first name that comes to mind and and you know she is In England, she's a people. Are big fan of hers because of that reason. She's just a very well round, educated person within the industry and has so much passion, and that's really, really important.
Speaker 1:Yeah, um, sophia staples that she. I, pina is her mentor and Sophia is killing it. She just like all in one show I think she's almost an open and she was from entry Like just being, that makes me want to learn from you. Know, like she just grew this girl and like slingshot at her.
Speaker 3:But also you'll have fun with Pina. Pina will make learning fun and it has to be. Yeah, when I've gone to some people and they'd be like, and I'm like, whoa, whoa, whoa, they are way too straight laced for me. I need to have you know what. There's gotta be 70% education, 30%. Let's have a little bit of a giggle time. Yeah, I want some personality to be coming out in in teaching because it makes you focus more. Make sure you enjoy more, just like when I'm doing a seminar. I mean, you know it's like it's important to you speak for five hours to a crowd. They're gonna get tired if you are boring.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, I've done lessons where I've had like sweat dripping down my neck because I swear that just like your wrist even more, and you're like so I wasn't even concentrating on the next way and then my hand like trying to like make this like sculpting Potter, I'm like I don't know what she wants me to do and it was like not even worth the money Because I wasn't worried about the groom, the dog, my technique. I was worried about the sweat and my, my wrist, for some reason like so.
Speaker 1:I'm with you. I want the fun, I want that.
Speaker 2:I want someone gonna put the why behind it. There needs to be passion and there needs to be fun for sure, because otherwise it's just like what is the point of any of this? You know, like, yeah, grooming dogs, it's not supposed to be, is not supposed to be. So one note or serious, or like cutthroat their dogs like they're fun and nature so Right, absolutely, you know.
Speaker 3:I mean, it is literally a creative job and we've created anything with what involves creativity. There is there's a personal aspect. There's that individually bringing out your individuality in that, in whatever you do, and also it's about you know, does it make you smile, does it make you enjoy it, and that's really, really important.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. Have you ever had a point in your life where you just kind of questioned what I know some people, some of my friends, they get like the contest rooming, it's expensive, you're going. Have you ever had that thought in your mind where you're like what am I doing all of this for? Should I keep going Like?
Speaker 3:Yeah, you know what? Yes, that happens to me. A lot happens to me when I was a competitor. It happens to me when I put on shows for people and people wait till last minute to enter, or not so much in America, but in the UK.
Speaker 3:They is terrible. I kind of you know. I think, when it comes to competing, people got realized you do it for two reasons. You do one for yourself and you do it to For the end goal of the end goal is to make room to USA. That's what you need to do and. But you have to understand but you're gonna go to a competition and you're even gonna be on or you're not. And even when you're on, you may not place and you gotta dislike, suck it up, go home and do it again. If you are that person who is a bad loser or you don't take the feedback correctly, that's when you got to see yourself. Maybe competing is not right for me.
Speaker 3:Right yeah, you know, you have to have the open mind, you have to realize that. You know it is subjective. Okay, and it's strange. I watch a Drag you on TV which is, yeah, I root for drag race, but for the horror. And the judge say you know, I'm not judging you on your drag. Drag is subjective, it's what you bring to the table for that challenge. The same dog grooming.
Speaker 3:You know you go into a poodle class and it's my opinion on whether you place on. It doesn't mean the same at my opinion is the perfect one or the right one or anything is. But you have to as a judge also. I have to also put my opinion in the back seat and judge the dog on how you've groomed it, not on how I have Would have been important for me to judge it on. Okay, what could, what could you have done to make that dog better? And I always look at the good and the bad. So what they've, what they've done the dog and once again it's making that Be called a shit sandwich, good and negative and a good.
Speaker 3:When it comes to feedback, I'm, but obviously you know it's about. You know nine times that ten. I tell people walk around the dog with me, one judge and you will know exactly why. You probably haven't placed and we know. But then again we can do some really kick ass, good job, good work, and we don't place and we wonder why. But we also have to realize there's Ten, fifteen people in that ring. We haven't come there dogs. We don't know what they bought to the table, you either, and sometimes it literally does come down to his literally.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, so yeah yeah, I.
Speaker 2:So I I still consider myself like a baby competitor. This is like I'm going into like my second Yearish, maybe third, I don't know. But I just got into open and I've been showing up and trying and I feel like I'm getting to that point where I'm just being like Really hard on myself. What advice would you give somebody that is like going through something like that and I'm not saying I'm showing up and expecting the place because I'm not, because I look around and I see like the people that have trained me and I see like my idols and people that I want to be like, and then when I'm not as good as them, I just get really like down on myself and it's something that I'm trying to recover from, but it's so hard.
Speaker 3:Okay. So the first one I'd say to you well done for not stopping. And because a lot of people, when they get to champion division, as we call it in England, which is the same as open, they just don't bother no more because they don't think there's no point in competing against the, the groomed team people or whatever like that. So well done for keep on going back into that division, thank you. Don't ever give up. You will have your time where it will be all about you. Believe me, I tell people in this industry we all have our time where we shine, where we place, and you'll get a winning streak, you know and all that. Like Jacob, I remember Jacob many, many years ago and now that kid Still on it, so it should turn away. He's super hot. He turns into this tattoo kid.
Speaker 2:I love in the depth.
Speaker 3:He's such a nice kid and you know what his grooming has evolved. So you know what? When it comes to what you're doing, you know what? Obviously, I haven't seen. I haven't seen your work, I have my comb on your work, but you know what? Just do what I did and try and get around as many people as possible. And obviously it comes down to the dogs also, because when you're in entry or intermediate, you sometimes have entry or intermediate dogs.
Speaker 3:When you get up to open, the dog has to match the open class. So if it's a wheat and terrier it better be some kick ass. Look in wheat and terrier or if it's a Portuguese war dog.
Speaker 3:So these people then go to the next level and find awesome show dogs and all this kind of stuff to compete with. So don't give up, please don't give up, because you will have your time where it will be all about you and you know what. You will learn and evolve without even knowing it. You know you'll be like looking at your first thing and shit, that doesn't look bad, it's pretty good, and so it will change and before you know it you'll start kicking ass and then you'll be wearing a groomed and semi-safe smart.
Speaker 1:And I promise you, you will, you will. I see, gavin, this year you're growing and like your skill, even from intermediate entry, like what you're doing. Are you crying?
Speaker 2:I'm crying, not to.
Speaker 1:Oh, bless you. Oh, it's because his heart he wants in. We see, like I see your work being like a hundred percent even better from when you were getting the trophies. Like I see this year being your year of growth and like you are going and going to mentors and ask and everybody for help, but it just makes me feel.
Speaker 2:It makes me feel really like seen to hear like your story column, because I like relate so much of like not being the shy person but I like I get it everything you said and I feel like I'm going through it right now. So to just like see you on the other end of that is just like very inspiring.
Speaker 3:Especially, how are you right now? I'm 24. How old are you again?
Speaker 2:I'm 24.
Speaker 3:24. Oh, my God so you're baby.
Speaker 3:You know what? Yeah, exactly. So I'm 30 years older than you. So I mean, believe me, you have. You know, you have a very exciting career and you should be excited about it. And yes, it is. It's like, oh God, I'm going to go to a show. But you know what? Always go to a show with a I'm not saying I'm going to kill it attitude, or we just don't ever go with, don't ever sabotage yourself or all that kind of stuff. You know what scrutinize these people that you, that you respect and that you love and you want to be the one to be like, and you know what? They've all been there too. Every one of them people have been there exactly the same position where you're at, and then they will just totally go 360 and then they start winning and start, you know, reaching that dream. So you've reached your dream before in entry and intermediate. Now you're in open and it just becomes a little bit harder, but you can do it.
Speaker 1:Yeah. Well, thank you I also want to brag on my friend. He's only groomed for four years. Yeah so and like he's competed for two years, we both started the same thing.
Speaker 2:We're here for calling.
Speaker 3:No, yeah, really, I mean my God.
Speaker 1:We both just broke that in full tears for a minute.
Speaker 3:No, it's great, though no it's important to me to encourage people. So it means you know me saying things to encourage people will make a difference. That's what it's all about and that is what this industry is about. It's about, you know, having people ask questions and you know, want to find out what it's like. I know what it's like to be in the ring. I die a thousand deaths when I competed in the ring and then you gradually you know, gradually, I'm not saying it doesn't I think it's good to have that feeling of nerves, because when you go in the ring to confident, that's when things don't work out, you know, and all that kind of stuff. So it's good. And you know what? Yeah, open divisions suck sometimes because you like shit. You know what am I going to do, but you know what you will surprise yourself. Promises, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I try to go in and just I try to focus on my dog until the end and then, once you know awards are done and everything, then I want to see everybody's dogs and I want to like talk to them and that's when I want to learn from them like what they did that I didn't do. I want everybody to like put a comb on my dog and tell me what I could have done differently. So it's like it's hard, but I like I feel like I learned so much, just like at the end of a contest and just like yeah, what dog was you doing in Hershey?
Speaker 2:So I'm on the waitlist for everything. Because everything fills up so fast here I hopefully can get into at least sporting. I've been really working on my cockers but I have a carry blue I'll bring to just in case I get in.
Speaker 3:But hopefully at least I mean you got peanut there too, so you know it's going to be on the trace and grab peanut. Me and peanut can both talk to you and all that kind of stuff and give you some advice and tips and all that kind of stuff. That's what you want to do. You want to just get with people and just get all the information possibly get.
Speaker 2:Yeah. So I have another question as somebody who judges grooming contest what are some things you feel like competitors are not doing that they should be doing, like? Is there something that you want to see more of, just like in terms of behavior, or in terms of like, even breeds that you don't see enough of? I'm curious what your thoughts are. I.
Speaker 3:Think, when it comes to breeds, I think we're all. We're all been Pushing some crazy breed line in super zoo. That, the Irish wolf, how much was?
Speaker 2:it.
Speaker 3:From Jovi from Canada. I mean hell, that girl hands through that dog. I would not want to do that. I'd be like I'm too old.
Speaker 3:You know what I turned into at my age. I, every time I groom dogs, I am the tiny little fluffy dog groomer I Anything that I got a fight with I once like tiny and small, I can whip out an hour. There you go and and also I'm a pet groomer and that is where I make my money. And yeah, we've got to be realistic about this. So what I do teach, I'm teaching people how to make money and that's pet grooming. But in the competition ring, I think People, the only thing people have to get More, they have to be more aware of, is where they start, where they finish and how they work in a routine.
Speaker 3:So, blocking the dog in making sure, but you block the dog in first, you can see the instant shape and then all you have to do is fill in the blanks, fill in the volume. So you know. But I think it's pretty much Good. I do see some people and I look at their dog and I'm thinking, oh, my god, that dog was beautiful half hour ago. Yeah, you know, so you got to learn when to say it looks awesome, don't take them air off, don't know, you know, you got, sir, you know.
Speaker 3:But then again you're given time. But when I was given two and a half two hours on the bedlinson I would use up every minute and when I was given an hour and a half I'd use up every minute. So I think it comes down to have that photo image in your head, to make sure you have it stamped in your head. And also what I would do on my competition dogs when I competed I would wash, dry them, give them a haircut. Then they would go directly in the bathtub again. I would wash or wet them down, dry them and any little bits of hair sticking out I would cut off again. So when they went in the ring six weeks they would have a perfect haircut to follow.
Speaker 3:Yeah don't go in the ring with too much hair, because you're only giving yourself more work. You know you got to be in it to win it and you got to play the game. And, believe me, there's a game to be played. And so when you see people go in the ring and you're like shit, that dog looks like it was done. Will it come in the ring? I'm not saying do that, but don't get yourself too much hair. Yeah that's definitely me.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:I like that.
Speaker 2:Yeah. I definitely brought my. All my super zoo dogs had too much hair, I think.
Speaker 3:Always go. I always say a week to the most. When you're coming with 12 weeks, you have to redesign a haircut.
Speaker 3:Yeah you got to read, you got to put the lines in again. You don't want to do that because you're giving yourself too much work, plus the added stress, plus this, plus that and plus everything else. So you have to say I want to go in the ring and I want to kind of, you know, put the lines in, but the lines what I'm following, and then it's a finish I have to put on that. Then you'll be fine.
Speaker 2:I love that you said that like routine is something that's missing, because I'm I'm teaching my first trade show class at Hershey and it's about routine for like pet groomers. But I feel like competing helped me in pet grooming so much, because I I used to be like as a pet groomer, I was scared to take off hair and when you get in the ring, you can't, you can't be scared of that because you only have so much time and you've got to whack it off and you got to keep going.
Speaker 2:So I love that. That's something that you mentioned. It kind of does work both ways.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and you, what you gotta realize is sometimes the mistake you make on a dog by you thinking, oh my god, I've gone too short is the length you actually should be taking it down to. So sometimes, you know, I tell my students you're here to make mistakes, I'm here to tell you how to fix them. Do not be afraid to cut and hair off when you're, when you're at school, and also what? When I'm with my students, I have an egg timer and I put the egg timer on for five minutes. When that five minutes is over, whether they finish or not on that leg, they move on to the next leg. So in 5, 10, 15, 20, they worked on four legs and then they work again in five minutes. Because I say to them You'll be surprised how many times you can open and close a scissor in a minute.
Speaker 3:So when you're working and I'm a fast scissor, I Learned that in Hong Kong because everything I I dream about 20 pomerami in today and it's like they you know. So you kind of you know you want to work in that routine. Obviously, in the salon routines have to be broken when a dog has is stressed out or you have to work around the dog's needs. But Normally every single time on a world world groom dog or well behaved dog, I have that routine. I work from the rear, the front, the underlying top line, and I bring it all in together.
Speaker 2:Let me write this down. Let me write this down so.
Speaker 3:If you set your rear angulation in and then you put your front in, then you have taken a dog which maybe should be square. You've made it into that that nice but that nice size. And then you bring your underline, then you do your top line, that everything else is filling in the volume and making it look all beautiful.
Speaker 3:You know it's just, but it's having the the time and the fire. Tell people, when you have that time in the salon you have that beautiful dog. Take your time, make it a beautiful work in that routine, but work in obviously, your own routine when you go from back leg to front leg to this to that. Yeah, you'll never get the dog done in time. You'll be all over the place.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, I'm curious, since you teach a lot of pet groomers, what does your routine look like for? Like, if you were in the salon grooming a pet like, what does that look like for you?
Speaker 3:So okay, still comes in. Depending on how much to hear the dog has on it, it will go on the table Quick. If it's got a lot of code, a quick clip off or whatever on the body, not in any kind of. You know, I'm not making the perfect, I just want to whack off here, go to the bathtub, I will see shampoo the dog. The head gets shampooed last and rinse up first. That way if there's any shampoo in the eyes it comes right out. Not that we're going to, we're, not that we aim into get shampoo in the dog's eyes.
Speaker 3:And then I work in a routine where the real eggs is one, the middle sections to the front, sections three. So I tell people you do not leave that one area until it's totally dry, but you move on, then you move on and obviously the pastons, hawks and Inside always gets dried first. Because you're a lot of times with students. They will only dry what they can physically see Name of washing dogs. They were only washed out properly what they can physically see, meaning the Hawks are still dirty, the pastons are still dirty. So you know I tell them get. You know, whatever you can't see, walk on that more. You know that's how I work yeah.
Speaker 2:That's great, I follow a pretty similar routine, yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's just you know, having you know, I mean I want the dogs, I mean I have I always say I got a student right now who's pretty amazing and she's on day 10 and she's just Sailing through it and I keep to a very Blueprint of a schnauzer. So the body on most dogs is a blueprint pattern of a schnauzer, meaning longer with a comb attachment Obviously, yeah, no.
Speaker 3:I said when I was a, because rear angulation, want to take that out nice and clean around the bum. Yeah, you know you're, and your minimal scissor work on the Hawks and the strifle skirt on or off depend on what it is and then nice little legs and Acute face of whatever breed it resembles. But you know, I mean, I think in this industry what we forget about is, you know, the pet grooming is a huge, huge part of it, a competition and dog show. It is a small.
Speaker 1:Yes, yeah. And I know most of yeah, most of our listeners and our stats it's you could tell it's like there's not a lot of contest groomers in here. I always try to make sure we talk to the pet owner, because those are our listeners.
Speaker 3:Absolutely. Yeah, exactly, you know. I mean, if you think about it, let's just say a cockapoo, lapadoo, whatever, whatever you know what they want to have a and I will call it a breed cut, cut, because you know what. I do not like people or groomers arguing with a client just because a client says do you know what a breed standard haircut is? You know a dog, a cockapoo, has angulation, just like a lapadoo, spanish water dog. So you know what. If they want to call it a breed, let them call it a breed. So I say to them when they say to me, do you know what to do on this breed? I'm like, yep, I do. I do a peach comb attachment all over with a cute face and because I know that's what they want. Like, my lecture in Hershey is about giving the customer too much leeway and explaining to us. We complain too much about a client when they don't know what the hell to tell us what to do with their dog. Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:It's not their job. We ask them stupid questions. When we went to school, we should be saying, oh my God, angus the Westie, he would look beautiful in this haircut.
Speaker 1:They would normally say to you after you go and do it. Yep.
Speaker 3:We shouldn't be asking clients how do you want your dog room? Because you're going to be told you're throwing the customer of curveball and you're going to get the wrong answer and then bitch about them at the same time, when all they're trying to do is answer your question. Well, they don't know.
Speaker 1:They don't know. They don't know what they don't know. I always tell, like the analogy of when you're in the backseat of the car. I think I've already brought this up in our podcast like three times, but I have a seminar on that and it's like when you're in the backseat of the car and everyone knows the song that's going and you don't know this song, but everyone's jamming and bopping and singing and you're singing like watermelon, watermelon, watermelon what?
Speaker 1:You know, and you're having the best time, and then the driver looks back and says see, you don't know the lyrics. Like this has happened to me. I'm like you're right, I don't know, and then you feel immediately dumb. That's like the same thing we're doing to our pet owners, you know where they just want to be in the backseat owning a dog with all the other dog people.
Speaker 3:It makes me laugh when people complain. When a person complains about a matter dog, I'm like it's your job as a dog room and just shave it off. You know what A person buys a dog. Okay, they buy a dog. They love a dog. We hope they feed it in water. We hope that's all we can really want from them. Yes, we would love it if they brush the dog to exactly our standards, but you know what that's way too much to ask.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, If you think about it, before you became a groomer or even knew what grooming is, is dog grooming a thing that ever even crossed your mind? Because for me it never did.
Speaker 3:Exactly. I mean, I literally used to brush my. I had a German ship at Mexico brand. I'd brush him in the back garden and you know just, and I literally I brought and to get there this is the funniest I bought a duplex stripper knife, which was one of them nasty things with a razor blade in it. I've got down his back and they'd be just a fair thing now.
Speaker 3:And you know what I mean. I thought, look, look what I'm doing. I'm thinking, and my mum be like whoa, take that away from you. But yeah, I mean, I had no clue what I was doing, but I thought I was doing a good job. But that's because this, once again, some you know somebody in a pet shop. I wasn't explaining, probably, what the correct coat I had on my dog was, so or maybe I just picked up and like, oh, this looks like a good murder tool, it's gonna work it. Yeah, my dog with it, you know.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, yeah, it's always miscommunication. We expect too much from our pet owners.
Speaker 3:Absolutely. I always talk to people. Absolutely.
Speaker 1:They're like I'm gonna go and get my dog a pair of pants and tell them all right, this is your dog, this is, you know, the coat type. This is the schedule I definitely recommend. If budget wise it doesn't work like that, let's do this shorter haircut.
Speaker 1:We could just squish it up 12 weeks Exactly. You know, make this little pyramid of like. You know the yes, no chart, and people can't see my hands, but you know, if it's no, then you're going to move it to the yes until you're in the yes dumpster on the bottom, so you're gonna have a lot of people do that.
Speaker 2:And then you know if you're already starting your clients a little bit too much lead way when really we should be the one leading the dance. And this might, I don't know. I a lot of people hate pet grooming and some days like it's overwhelming, you know, and it's a lot, but like like I groomed dogs all day today and like I had a good day Like I groomed, I groomed five doodles today, how often they're willing to come and like what level of maintenance they are willing to do and like what they want to pay for. And then we have that and we're good to go and I never have to have that conversation again because it's just the same every time and I know what to expect and I don't know. That's not bad, it's just getting to that point.
Speaker 3:I think sometimes we can make our job way, way too stressful. We have to understand. But if you are having a stressful day at work all the time and you need to reevaluate how your day is running, what you're doing are you grooming too many dogs? What are you doing? And then go from there?
Speaker 1:So, gavin, did you know Colin was a judge on Pooch Perfect?
Speaker 2:No, I did not know that yeah yeah, tell us about your experience there.
Speaker 3:I was on the Pooch Perfect with Rebel in Australia and it was amazing. It was a really good experience for me, taking me out of my comfort zone, and I ended up really loving it. And it was done very similar to America, without all the color, thank God. And then it was. We went to England and in my opinion, it was done amazing In England. We did the coat types. We did the wall coat, the strip coat, the silky coat and we covered everything and we did very little creative because we knew the back lash we would get and we still got back lash, even with 10% color.
Speaker 3:It was a good experience, it was amazing, and when the American one come out, I was, let's just say, I'm glad I didn't do the American one Because, first of all, the judges didn't say hardly anything at all. It was. I like shows which are not based on the backstory of the person itself. However, I would say this the best people did win the American one. I think they got it right. When it came to Macy and her partner, Winnet Gabriel did very well also, but I also. You know they were incredible from the start and the creative challenges to me were a little bit just. You know, it's like you got to be careful and our job isn't about that anyway. Our job's not about covering dogs all day long.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. So I think it's important.
Speaker 3:So I love the journey it took me on. During the Australian version, rebel was amazing, amazing. In England we did it with an actress called Sheridan Smith, who was also amazing, and it was just good, I think it. I think it highlighted the industry to a point, but also I think they could have done things to make it a little bit more exciting. But my mum would call up and she'd say, oh, I just saw you on TV, you're amazing. And my dad would be like what a load of old shit that was. It was boring Because you know what and I get it, you know, to somebody who's not a dog groomer or they're not, you know what they're not into that I could see it being boring.
Speaker 3:I think it could have been a little bit more exciting and you know. So, hey, I think it's one of them things where you know it didn't make. It didn't make season two in either country America, australia even though the, the viewers, the viewers in England, were up there with the same as RuPaul's Drag Race, but it still had a lot of backlash.
Speaker 1:Yeah, more than people drag race.
Speaker 3:So it goes to show that people would rather watch drag queens and dog rooming.
Speaker 2:And then dogs. And that's so great because I love, I'm a dog groomer, and I think I feel the same way yeah.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you know what you know. I love drag race and also with drag race you get to, you get to understand the people you know and even though you did a little bit, in. Pooch Perfect. It would have been better to you know if we had a little bit more story about why people got into dog grooming, why they think it's hard all that kind of stuff, yeah, so yeah, awesome yeah.
Speaker 2:How did you find out that you were going to be on that project? Like, I'm so curious, like were you just one day got an email and it was like hey, do you want to do this thing?
Speaker 3:Well, I was. I literally came to Seattle to cause Coleman got his visa, so we were coming back to England together. I landed in London, I got a phone call and it was a woman from Australia. She goes I'd like to talk to you about a project we're doing in on Channel seven. We, we want an international mail and we want you to be the judge. And I'm like, and I'm like no, no, no, there's no way in hell I'm going to do it. And then my husband says, Colin, you do realize, if you don't do it and you see the person who took your place, you're going to be raging. And I'm like, yeah, you're right. So I said, okay, I'll do it. How much?
Speaker 1:Yeah, so um have a seat me.
Speaker 3:And I said to her do you, I do, I get the fly business? I went no, so flying to Australia and the economy is hard work. Let me tell you I did that and it was. You know what, even if I did it for free, which I didn't, but had I done it for free, it still would have been the best thing in the world. And Rebel even said to me look, she says when I, when I did my first TV show on bridesmaids on TV, the movie she goes, I made five grand. Yeah, so she paid a face, she made five grand from that role and she goes. And then obviously her career took off with a pitch perfect. But she's, you know. But but I went there. You know I'm not looking at being on, whatever, making it afraid and all that stuff after you know, but I did it for the experience and for my resume and just to say you know what. That was fun, I enjoyed it, yeah.
Speaker 2:Yeah, did you get to help like have a say in who the competitors would be.
Speaker 3:No, all the competitors were picked and then we had to. As soon as I got there, we went and looked at the storyboard and all that, all the people that were on the show and all that. So, yeah, it was fun.
Speaker 1:I love that. So, other than being a TV personality now and you have your own product line and you're a judge and obviously you work, content, groomer and a speaker. And every day grooming groomer and a teacher. Is there anything else you are doing that you know? We didn't highlight on.
Speaker 3:No, I think I've done everything. The only thing I my goal is what's my goal? Yeah, what's coming up new for you. What do I have? I want to implement a judges educational program. That's why that's what I do. So judges can continue the education and say but they are qualified judge.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I do wish, like I feel I never feel like I've gotten bad critiques or I've never not like appreciated a judge, but I do wish I could like expect the same like level of education from my judge every time, because sometimes and I know like it's crazy and it's busy, but sometimes it'll be like you did the best you could and then like yeah, yeah, exactly.
Speaker 1:So I know of a company that could help you build a curriculum to do this Really.
Speaker 3:I bet you do. I do know I'll have to talk to that person, won't I?
Speaker 1:Yeah, because we can make your dreams happen.
Speaker 3:Well, that's great. I would love that because it needs to be done. I want it to be so. You compete, you become whatever you become. Say, you're a multi contest winner. I think that it should be something to say, but you know what I'm qualified to judge.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it kind of keeps the accountability there, and that's where education on my hat that's something I absolutely love is you know, you went through the reading, you watched the video you took a test and you were assessed. And that way if you didn't do ABCND, well, why didn't you? You just took this whole board. That's right. So you told me you were accountable to do this. So, yeah, I'd love to help my team help you write a curriculum.
Speaker 3:Absolutely. I'd love it. That would be good, just to let you know you can cut this out. But my battery I don't want my battery to die and it's getting low.
Speaker 1:Okay, I'm going to say I just ran to get my battery.
Speaker 3:I thought I had my cord and I didn't, and I really I feel terrible.
Speaker 1:We're at almost an hour anyway.
Speaker 3:So we are perfect.
Speaker 1:We'll end on that note. But yeah, maybe we'll have a curriculum, a partner with Colin Taylor and Grim Curriculum.
Speaker 3:Yeah, watch out future everybody. And before I go I want to say congratulations on your Barclay nominee.
Speaker 2:Oh, thank you. Thank you so much for being here.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you know, I've won it. For you know what I have to be honest. I've won it three years in a row.
Speaker 2:I was going to say you did win last year too.
Speaker 3:I think it's amazing and I would be totally grateful again if I did, but I also would be very, very happy if somebody else was to get the glory of winning and feeling that you know having that feeling.
Speaker 3:Yeah, you know, I've won it three years in a row. I mean that's great. I've got three Barclay awards in my office and I think it's wonderful, so it would be lovely. Obviously, I'm very, very proud of being nominated and all that kind of stuff, but it also would be lovely to see somebody else get the glory too.
Speaker 1:I love that. That just shows your heart, I love.
Speaker 3:I love heart people.
Speaker 1:Those are my people, so absolutely, absolutely.
Speaker 3:That's what I'm looking for. I'm looking forward to seeing you in Hershey, gavin.
Speaker 2:Yes, I'm very excited to see you there. If I get into a contest. I'm going to find you. I'm going to hunt you down with my dogs.
Speaker 1:You need to hunt him down with your dogs.
Speaker 3:anyway, you're more than welcome to Please do, because you know what I mean. You're more than welcome to absolutely come see me, come see Pina, and we will help you.
Speaker 2:Thank, you so much and thank you for being here, no problem.
Speaker 3:Thank you for having me again.
Speaker 1:This was fun. We'll have to do it again and we'll jump on your podcast next. So yeah, I will have you.
Speaker 3:I get back on the 13th so I will get in contact with you and we'll have to get you. On the content, I like to know your stories.
Speaker 1:Heck. Yeah, let's do it Well. Thank you so much. You have a good weekend.
Speaker 3:You too, take it easy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, bye, bye.
Speaker 3:Bye.